Talk:Haut-Rhin

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Alsace region

Hi, Since the new French reformation of administrative regions has been acted, the administrative region named Alsace does not exist anymore, thus leading to the traditional conception of Alsace that is the 3 districts of Haut Rhin, Bas Rhin and Territoire de Belfort. So now the conception that remains about the territory is about the traditionnal area. The question as been discussed on the French page: https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alsace. I guess the contributors on the French article are well aware about this issue. And I would add, that an administrative change does not effect the conception of a HISTORICAL region I am more than happy to contribute about this issue in a civil and polite way, as many ideas could emerge through discussion. But cancelling edits with ironic comments are not very helpful nor constructive.--Gabriel HM (talk) 10:02, 17 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

But Territoire de Belfort was only called so after it was detached from Alsace and rattached to France-Comté. Before, it didn't exist as a department or a separate territory, it was simply a part of Haut-Rhin. I don't know you personally but my impression is that you are more familiar with other regions of France than with Alsace. --Edelseider (talk) 10:11, 17 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Edelseider I am not here to make any personal judgements or attacks, this is not the place, so please refrain to do so. You are indeed making a confusion about the notion of historical and administrative region [1]. But perhaps according to you all the contributors of the Alsace article in the French wiki are not as informed as you are about this issue as well.... TDB was part of the sundgau [2] (see this map from 1648). So if you are talking about the historical Alsace it is 68,67, and TDB. It is not because the area has been administratively detached from Alsace in 1871 because of the treaty of Frankfurt, that it has an impact on a historical region. Finally it looks that I know my region pretty well ;)--Gabriel HM (talk) 10:26, 17 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

(after edit conflict) Try to follow. It's not difficult. You wrote that Haut-Rhin is one of the three departments that composed the historical Alsace. In reality, Alsace was always composed of two departements. The third one, Territoire de Belfort, was made into a department after it was detached from Alsace. What you want to say is: the historic territory (not the administrative or political but the geographical entity) once covered these three departments of today. But that doesn't mean the same as saying (as you did) that Alsace was composed of three departments. Because it never was!

I promise that I'll never edit any article on the Maurienne territory because I know nothing about it. You should be so humble about Alsace, too. --Edelseider (talk) 10:36, 17 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

Edelseider I do not follow your edits as it seems that you are doing with mine on several wiki since for exemple my edits about maurienne are mostly in French... But as you are a French speaking user regarding my tracking, and the French sources that you gave in the articles where we contribute jointly, let me tell you that what you are doing is called "rétropédalage". Indeed, I have never said that TDB was a department, on the contrary on my edit that you have cancelled scornfully [3] I talked about 2 department and a territory that were forming the historical region as you are well aware that a province is a historical conception, (but maybe that was too "technical" for you). It is you on the contrary that kept making the confusion between the administrative region and the historical one on your edits and comments until I had to show you historical maps and other articles. So please refrain to try to teach me a historical course about Alsace. Maybe you learned that Belfort was part of the Sundgau too :) .And indeed as I wrote in my former edit, there are others departments that are more densely populated. Please next time before cancelling edits with those kind of comments, take the time to discuss, and I don't get the impression that you are so "humble" when I look to your actions on this particular issue. Bonne continuation, .--Gabriel HM (talk) 11:00, 17 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]