Talk:Political views of Adolf Hitler

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• Mein Kampf – Volksausgabe (1933).jpg

Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 00:11, 23 January 2021 (UTC)

"Unsourced"

This is the first time I've contributed to this article, and of course, my contribution has its source. Reference is also provided for the quote in Stefan Ihrig's book. See. - Aybeg (talk) 10:28, 3 March 2021 (UTC)

Yes, my initial edit summary was incorrect.

The problem is that the quote from the book you provided does not directly support the declarative statement you made, which is that Ataturk influenced Hitler's belief in the power of the will. The quote is about something entirely different, "Atatürk was the first to show that it is possible to mobilize and regenerate the resources that a country has lost." That has nothing to do with belief in the force of will.

While I don't doubt that Ataturk may have had some influence on Hitler, I don't believe that the importance of "will" was one of them, since it's present in Hitler's speeches and writing almost from the beginning. In any case, you need a citation or quote that directly supports the contentionsthat Ataturk was influential in Hitler forming his belief in the force of will. Beyond My Ken (talk) 10:38, 3 March 2021 (UTC)

@Beyond My Ken I see. Well, can't a new subheading be opened? Like "Inspirations", "Interwar influences", or "Foreign influences during the interwar period". Mussolini can also be included in that subheading. Maybe @Buidhe would like to comment on this topic. - Aybeg (talk) 07:41, 5 March 2021 (UTC)

• Yes, Ihrig does argue that Ataturk/Turkey (or at least what Nazis thought Turkey was) was more significant influence on Nazism than Mussolini/Italy, although IIRC he focuses on the entire Nazi movement rather than Hitler specifically. Covering foreign influences here is reasonable but you have to be careful to stick with what the source says! (t · c) buidhe 15:50, 5 March 2021 (UTC)

• This view is not shared by any other subject expert that I'm aware of, making it WP:FRINGE and WP:UNDUE in this context. Beyond My Ken (talk) 02:11, 8 May 2021 (UTC)

@Luizpuodzius:

If you want to translate it, just give us a call. Regards 2804:14C:5BB1:8AF2:66FC:81CB:2576:144F (talk) 02:47, 26 December 2021 (UTC)

Alfred Rosenberg

User:Confluencerist, you have twice removed Alfred Rosenberg as an influence on Hitler, with the edit summary "Scholars have confirmed Alfred Rosenberg's philosophy and worldview were not influential on Hitler". However we've got at least four sources that say otherwise:

• Kershaw 2000, pp. 268–269
• Stern 1975, pp. 45–53
• Evans 2003 page 178 says: "Rosenberg more than anyone probably turned Hitler's attention towards the threat of Communism and its supposed creation by a Jewish conspiracy... 'Jewish-Bolshevism' now became a major target of Hitler's hate."
• Toland pp. 136-137 of the paperback edition covers influences similar to what Evans describes.

So if you with to remove Rosenberg as an influence, you will have to bring some sources to support your claim. Thanks, — Diannaa (talk) 12:37, 21 February 2024 (UTC)

Let's make that a third time Confluencerist (talk) 19:34, 21 February 2024 (UTC)

How about those sources then? — Diannaa (talk) 05:45, 22 February 2024 (UTC)

Undid the removal of Hitler's anti-Slavism

The user Obenritter removed the anti-Slavic aspects of Hitler's political views without any proper explanation, despite the contents being all backed up by academic sources. Some contents regarding Hitler's anti-semitism were removed as well.

The removed contents were all central aspects of Hitler's ideology and well within the scope of the article. I have reverted the page to the last stable version.

I'd just say that wikipedia is not censored and no editor should remove large amounts of reliably sourced content based on any POV bias.

Shadowwarrior8 (talk) 17:14, 23 March 2024 (UTC)

The material you added is already covered, which suggests that you have not read the article in its totality. Adding these redundant opinions from another scholar is not necessarily helpful without making it work with the existing content. For example, there is already content about how communism and Hitler's contempt for Slavs and Jews (anti-Semitism) factor into his political views. You probably should have added an expanded sub-category instead. Such changes sometimes merit reversion and discussion. Maybe an outside opinion on how best to make this new material most effective would be helpful here: @Nick-D: @K.e.coffman: @Kierzek: @GeneralizationsAreBad: @EyeTruth: @Beyond My Ken: @Diannaa: @Peacemaker67: @Nillurcheier: --Obenritter (talk) 20:06, 23 March 2024 (UTC)

"The material you added is already covered"

No. It wasnt. Anti-slavism wasnt even mentioned in this page, despite it being a central doctrine of Hitler's political ideology. Hitler's opposition against social democracy wasnt also mentioned before.

If you can demonstrate publicly that an actual repetition occurred in any of my edits, then I shall delete it. However, as everyone can see, you went far beyond that, dubiously removing all the sourced content which I edited in one stroke. I do want to assume good faith, and I hope that was a misunderstanding or some mistake on your part.

Thank you. Shadowwarrior8 (talk) 20:25, 23 March 2024 (UTC)

Yes, you are right in that social democracy was not covered under those terms but the sections "Social conservatism" and "Contempt for democracy" both are corollaries thereto. Adding something specifically about social democracy and its Slavic participants I guess comprises new information. However, the numbered/bulleted content about anti-Communism, anti-Semitism, colonialism (Lebensraum) etc. from Edmund Dmitrow is unequivocally redundant when contrasted against the content cited already from Andreas Hillgruber. Perhaps I was a tad hasty in removing some of it, but you are also adding content from NON-RS like Bob Carruthers and the like atop not integrating already discussed material. Regards--Obenritter (talk) 21:08, 23 March 2024 (UTC)

I dont see why Dmitrow's quote is "redundant" or "repetitive", since Hillgruber is talking about a different aspect of Hitler's political ideology. Other than that, your arguments are completely baseless.

However, I shall remove Dmitrow, in the interests of quickly achieving a negotiated solution. Shadowwarrior8 (talk) 21:34, 23 March 2024 (UTC)

I think the discussion could benefit from an academic input from the user Bobfrombrockley, who is an expert editor on the subject of fascist ideologies.

From my analysis of primary sources; anti-semitism, anti-Slavism, and anti-communism were the three driving doctrines of Hitler's political ideology. This is also backed up by vast amount of secondary, academic literature as well.

Shadowwarrior8 (talk) 9:18, 23 March 2024 (UTC)

Nowhere is anyone arguing that anti-semitism, anti-Slavism, and anti-communism were not integral components of Hitler's political view. Your additions were helpful, but not well-integrated or properly contextualized. My revert was about bringing you into a Discussion so that we can craft a better article. If you took offense to that, my apologies. You were right to add some emphasis to Hitler's anti-Slavism since it is mentioned in the article Summary. In fact, if you read what I said, it could stand its own section (an expanded sub-category). Placing it atop the content on Lebensraum and the invasion of the Soviet Union is not pedagogically nuanced enough--in my opinion as an educator and historian--for an encyclopedia and unnecessarily conflates them.

Maybe it's fine and just needs cleaned up some more. Let me work on this a bit. --Obenritter (talk) 21:57, 23 March 2024 (UTC)

Obenritter, thanks for the copy edit work in relation to the recent additions (including sfn formatting). This should not be a re-rash of the main article, nor verbose; the focus should be more narrow and writing tight, Shadowwarrior. With that said, some addition as to anti-Slavism was warranted. Kierzek (talk) 03:51, 25 March 2024 (UTC)

Kierzek Appreciate the clean-up work and I stand corrected Sir. Sorry to those following if this appeared convoluted. Sound oversight and concessions between participating parties have brought this to an amenable solution.--Obenritter (talk) 19:05, 25 March 2024 (UTC)

Obenritter, your work is appreciated, as I wrote above; no “correction” meant as to you, Sir. Cheers, Kierzek (talk) 22:56, 25 March 2024 (UTC)

@Nick-D:, @K.e.coffman:, Kierzek, for the reasons that follow, I had to revisit this topic, as the section's title and first sentence implied that anti-Slavism was the THE central idea that drove Lebensraum, which as we all know to be an oversimplification. It was as much about antisemitism as it was anti-Slavism, let alone the arable soil offered in the East for German settlers. While there are Slavic scholars who accentuate this aspect of Hitler's worldview, anti-Slavism does not get near the equivalent shrift and attention that antisemitism does in any of the major biographies. It was a factor to be sure, but the way the section was structured, front-loading and singularly calling out anti-Slavism as the most important factor in Lebensraum was misleading and reductionist in construct. Take a look at my changes and edit accordingly, where you deem appropriate. --Obenritter (talk) 20:44, 1 September 2024 (UTC)

That’s fine with me. Kierzek (talk) 19:22, 3 September 2024 (UTC)

Editors should read Mein Kampf and study more modern updated sources

Modern sources elucidate the anti-capitalist development of Hitler, his more complicated views on the implementation of democratic elements in a racial republic and what he most likely covered up after the fact in order to not detract from his own favorable impression as a resolute candidate for Führer. 83.255.180.77 (talk) 11:36, 6 May 2024 (UTC)

This is a vague, incomprehensible agglomerate of about eight subjects crammed into too few words. --Hob Gadling (talk) 13:52, 6 May 2024 (UTC)